Transcript

[0:00] All right, we're back for the post-show. We got some Cybertruck news, I think, right?

Craig conversation leads to discussion on fraud and Sam Bankman Freed

[0:06] Well, I mean, we had a lot of conversation about Craig today, so let's talk about fraud.
And let's talk about Sam Bankman Freed. Oh, boy.
Here, let's drink some of this Oxbow. All right. Oh, where's mine going?
There's just a little bitty bit left for the three of us, but I mean, it was... I might give you a little bit more of it.
Yeah, so I don't know if you're even following this Have you a little bit?
Yeah, do you know have you ever heard of Sam Bankman freed?
Yeah, I don't know I'm the crypto bro.
Yeah, he's uh It do you remember when they had that Larry David commercial for FTX and the Super Bowl?
So last year two years ago, I believe I I Get a lot of good.
Do you remember the crypto Super Bowl like all the commercials were crypto stuff?
Mm-hmm. That was kind of the year of Sam Bankman Freed's like ascendancy.

[1:11] Run-of-the-mill simple scammer Just using crypto as his stick managed to Convince people to give him billions of dollars.
Mm-hmm with which he squandered away on Just being a degenerate gambler like if you read into his The interviews and stuff like that.
He talks of all about He go he gets but he was also gambling at his own casino, yes But gambling in a way that that is.

[1:53] So he There's so much here.
It's hard to get to Have you I don't we mentioned this before there is a Podcast called search engine PJ avoid does it he used to do?
Certain used to reply all and He did a whole series like a four episode run on crypto island and it was on all things crypto including crypto island But there's a whole episode on Sam Beckman freed and how he ran this, Self-investing Ponzi scheme where he had these different two different coins and one was backed by the other one But he ran them both in new shit like that.
I mean like all of them the the Financial.

[2:40] Weirdness and shitter he did is kind of secondary to to me at least To what he presented himself as and what he actually was.
Something something altruism or whatever? Effective altruism, right?
He presented himself as this like boy genius son of two Stanford professors who had committed to giving away his entire fortune.
Because that was the most effective way to be a charitable person is to make a lot of money and then be a trade not the idea is how do you if you go and build somebody one house you've built somebody one house but if you make enough money to build 10,000 houses then you've affected the world a lot more that's the.

[3:37] Basic philosophical concept behind it and there's a lot of holes in if you really think about it because first of all how many people are you screwing over to get that much money and the second of all why is your judgment better than somebody else in terms of money on like this guy approved his judgment to spend money because look at what his judgment has done.
I mean he also had this philosophy of if it can't be summed up in a tweet it's too long.
Yes, he didn't think Shakespeare could not have been the best writer because of Bayesian priors, which I will get into how stupid an argument that is, but that is just magnificently using math in the wrong way, in a way It is just like...
Really really dumb Just dumb he he believed in his philosophy so much.

[4:46] But I would I want to I want to be clear about this if the Effective altruism was a scam from the start for him.
I Truly believe based on what I know about him now based on the information that he just used as sort of a cover.
His real philosophy was much more based in a gambler's ideal, which is if the bet is worth it, then you go for it.
He would always be talking about, in the stuff that I've seen, and in the in the trial it came up to, the effective value.
So even if the odds are worse for you, if the value is better, then it might be a better bet.
And you can actually, you know, you can do math on this to get to a certain point.
But one thing that his sometimes girlfriend co-conspirator, said about him was that he would, he had a idea that if you could flip a coin 50-50, that It would either destroy the world or make the world twice as good.
He would definitely take that bet Because he thinks the effect the the value the effective value of that is high I.

[6:10] Fucking wouldn't take that bet would you take that bet?
But if if so, I don't know his thoughts on this But I thought I heard it tied in is if you're living in a simulation then you take the bet.

[6:25] Like if you think you're that matter, I think you're living in the simulation Then you want to make it twice as good and there's like no cost.
I don't know how that simulation the whole simulation thing is yeah, I don't want to get into that because that we could go for hours on that one, too, and We're just running around in circles Because that's what that argument ultimately is.
Yeah But It's very like Early in his career, early in his founding of this FTX, which he started working on Jane Street, where Jane Street is this firm that hires a lot of math kids to do stuff, and in general it's fine because, yeah, you're playing with a lot of money, but it's a lot of money from like, you know, people who are billionaires, and like $100,000 is a big loss if you're talking about customers, But people who have a billion dollars hundred thousand dollars is fine to gamble.
That's nothing. That's pennies, right?
So It was fine to let kids gamble with that Because yeah, like one in a hundred are gonna be huge Exponential upgrade.
So yeah gamble with $100,000 here and there and he took that really to heart and.

[7:44] And later when he was founding FTX, he lost, I forget how many million it was, but it was a huge amount of millions that was lost, and he told the rest of his company, Oh, no, it'll come back.
Don't worry about it and The fact that he did that caused a lot of people to quit but then the people who stayed were really impressed when it was found and it came back and, So that was then they're looking at him going forward.
Oh, he can't go wrong whereas no, he just took a bet and, He got lucky Yeah, and he just kept then doubling down every time he lost money, he would spend other people's money because he figured eventually it'd be fine because he came from Stanford parents and if and if there wasn't if it wasn't fine he could just talk his way out of it.

[8:43] That was his shtick. That he's a fraudster.
He took customers' money because he thought he couldn't lose.
A degenerate gambler. That's all it was.
It is simple fraud, what it comes down to.
And you get this illusion of this smart guy, but it's just an illusion.
I mean, he did cloak it in some mumbo-jumbo, right?
You know, the stable coin, blah, blah, blah. Sure, yeah, but you put him on the stand, you ask him direct questions, and he has to try to weasel his way out of it, and that's obvious if you're, you know, with a partially decent prosecution, and this was a very good prosecution. Yeah.
When the government has you dead to rights, you're gonna lose.
There was, I know he made the bet in his head that the expected value of taking the stand in his own trial was high.
Never take the stand in your own trial.

[10:05] Especially if you did fraud Some people are so narcissistic though, they don't think they know What the they can just geno mind trick everyone else it kind of boggles the mind, but the real biggest issue is Sam McAfree is, That people Like regular people fell for it and put money in and lost lots of money Mm-hmm.
It wasn't just about, you know billionaires losing.
It was on the Super Bowl Yeah, I've been a real company if they're paying that much money for their they're buying The naming rights to a stadium.
They're putting their names on all the umpires and MLB They got to be legit.
Yeah, and Guess what crypto is not legit crypto is bullshit crypto you I Know there are people who have made money on it.
I I get it, it has happened.
There are people who've made money on pet rocks. Like, I mean, look, people make bets sometimes.
People make money on jackpots. It can happen.
You shouldn't be dreaming about jackpots. Like, I get like, you know, you pay a lottery when it gets to a billion dollars. Why not?

The Risks of Gambling and Casinos

[11:24] You're not going to win. You know you're not gonna win. But you play it because, I mean, you know, a cosmic miracle could happen.
But you don't play it every day. You certainly don't put a lot of your money into it.
Some people do. Some people do. And they go broke. The vast majority of those people go broke.
Just like if you go to a casino. Yeah, you can hit the jackpot.
It can happen. It has happened to people.
Probably less people than I've gotten stuck. Yeah For each one person a hundred or two hundred or a thousand people have to subsidize that jackpot, right?
So, yeah You're not very likely to be the person that wins nope, so, Don't I mean Don't make that bet just don't It's why I'm not I I don't like casinos. I just don't like him.
I I don't like him either. If I'm in there, I feel sketchy. And then if I make some money, I'm just pulling out immediately.
I, I recognize that I'm in there to lose money. And if I if I'm on top at all, I'm like, oh, OK, time to go. That's it.
Time to go over. Yeah.

[12:46] Doubling down is just not in my. Like, I don't have the fortitude for 50, 50 chance, man. Just put it on black.
That's the thing is like yeah, it's not Because there's that double zero.
Yeah, there's two not black or red squares. Yeah, yeah, so 50-50 It's not 50-50. That's how they get you.

[13:09] Yeah house always wins Unless you're fucking Sam Bankman freed and you're betting your own money as you said double dealing don't do that Don't bet your own money, Don't bet your custard like these people didn't pay to be gambled with.
You can't do that. That's fraud.

[13:30] Yeah. Yeah. So new table here in the kitchen. Yes.
So this is one. This is a long time in the making. Right? So this table, I'll just pull it back so you can see the beautiful cherry color on it.
I have to post a picture on Discord so people can see it before Shannon and I got this house.
Like a month before, we went to Construction Junction. Do you know what Construction Junction is? What's your function?
That's Conjunction Junction. I'm talking about Construction Junction, which is a place here in Pittsburgh, it's a non-profit, but they're a reuse, like a recycling reuse place for furniture and for construction materials and things like that.
So. Really good deals there. Okay. So you can get anything from tables. Toilets to tables.
To toilets. To doors. to beams, to toilets and tables is a really good slogan. Tiles.
Bathroom tiles hinges door hinges electrical outlets. I mean everything people would just take Construction refuse or you know, like old furniture.
They don't want windows.
How did I forget windows?
Yeah We got windows same time we got this table, you know, so I got this table it was Windows 8.

[14:56] Windows me. Oh, that's always always felt like a late like an effect.
You're having like, okay. I'm ready windows me All of my face, yeah So it was before we even got this place.
I was still living up to cranberry She was living in you know, granite council in Keysport the dark times.
Yes It was very dark times and we went to just from work one day I'm like when go shopping at construction junction look around them and they have this table we paid what $15 $15.
Yeah, it was rough, right? It was just and, It's been I took it to my parents house and kept it in their shed until we close on this house Then we move we brought it here, but it's been down in the garage covered over I just didn't have a shop set up and stuff to refinish it had shit piled on it.
Yeah, so I don't know a month ago. I started reworking it and getting it, you know refinished and whatnot Got it done. So it's pretty cool. It's really cool.
Like the thing we bought for this house, you know got refinished And now it's a beautiful table and paid 15 bucks for it.
Yeah That's that's a good price for this table and last Sunday you were were you?

Furniture Haul and Refinishing Projects

[16:10] Yeah, I Sunday Sunday, um, I went back.

[16:17] To CJ. Instruction junction. With the truck. I was so empowered.
I went for a stool for our shop so that I could do my power carving, sitting on a stool instead of standing for 12 hours on my feet.

[16:35] And well, you can't just go in and just get one thing. And I had the truck.
And I was so empowered, I was like, yes! I've got the truck, I can buy whatever I want, and I can put it in the back of the truck, and I can bring it home, and I can do whatever I want with it, and I did.
And I came home with some furniture that I am going to take apart.
I'm gonna start tomorrow, actually, taking apart.
It's antique furniture, some dressers that are down in the garage right now. They're really pretty.
I sent him some pictures and I was like, I need to get this.
He's like, go for it, do it, whatever. You said something like, yeah, get it.
I mean, they weren't $15 pieces of furniture. No, they weren't $15 pieces of furniture, but they were still low enough in the price that once I take them apart and like rehabilitate them, they will be...
Especially the dresser tops are fucked right now, so they need some work, but... But it's not gonna really be that hard to do.

[17:55] One thing that's weird about me that in watching all of these different YouTube channels on, you know, these makers' YouTube channels and stuff, Your left ear, that's weird about you. What's that?

[18:12] And then all the reels on Instagram and stuff. Everybody hates to sand.
Yeah, of course. It's the most boring thing in the world.
Okay, but I find it very relaxing.
I find it to be... You are a unique flower. I am, yeah.
There's just something about sanding. It can get tedious.
But most of the time when I'm sanding, I'm just like, oh, this is nice.
And it's kind of like meditation.
Working on the wood lathe is better than that.
But the sanding part of the lathe is really good. I'm way too impatient for that.
I am... No. I cannot...
I don't have the patience at all. I get bored way too easily.

[19:18] Don't know. I mean, I know I'm bored really easily I have that what I'm cooking like when you're trying to make good cuts of things.
It's really easy to get bored and just start Not caring we cook in risotto.
We're yet to keep feeding it and stirring it It's more like I want to get these onions really finely diced and it's like, okay All right.
Now I want to Julian these carrots Now the mise en place is the worst part.
Yeah, like doing, making sure all your cuts are even, like that takes effort.
And I've gotten to the point where, come the realization that I have to do that quick or else I get too bored and they become real.
While we're talking about it, I'm sorry to interrupt you, I don't forget.
You have good steel knives? I do, yes. If you want them sharpened, bring them up.
I got a good sharpener. Oh, yeah, yeah, I have a good sharpener now.

[20:23] Cool I mean I have a home sharpener, but you know, it's a It's a mechanical one.
I played around with this doing it on the stone and it's it's I'm just still a wheel But it's it's me.
It's a good sure. Yeah, I'm not good at it And it would take me a lot of effort to become really good bring up your knives. Okay sharpen up I can definitely do that.
I have a knife thing tonight cuz Um, like when I go to the Cape, I bring my knives because the knives that they have on the house suck.
And the reason I asked Greg, for people listening, if they're steel, because if they're ceramic, I can't sharpen them. So yeah.
No, they're worse stuff. My good chef's knife is the worst stuff.
Okay. What are you drinking?
It's pizza. Pizza boy. Oh, okay. I thought you were drinking. No. My Mary.
There's magnolias. you mentioned a truck you have an f-150 I believe yeah they they extend a cab and what about the fucking cyber truck here's a here's a video that I put in the show notes I didn't see the video it was in it was in the Twitter but is it the one where got stuck I think so yeah.

[21:36] So the Cybertruck weighs like 7,000 pounds.
And yeah, so they went out in the desert and did this thing and someone posted the video of the parts, the bloopers, where the truck got stuck.
Craig was talking about this earlier today. Craig, everyone's favorite Craig.
And he said that Ford took the F-150 Lightning Took the f-150 lightning on the same course and you know, it just kind of had no problems at all. Yeah, Yeah, the f-150 lightning is the electric version Oh, so but you know, basically apples to apples you can buy electric cyber trucker You can buy the f-150 lightning.
So the other Twitter that I put is that did you know that that they released a beer with?
This I Saw yeah, I saw you posted.
Mm-hmm. What? Elon Musk beer.
Yeah, so I guess it's a Bach or something.
It was a hundred fifty bucks for two for two bottles and like it was apparently like terrible and and it was rusted.
The caps were rusted and it's just like wow.
Fantastic.

SpaceX's Expensive Beer and Falcon Heavy Launch

[22:54] Like you didn't even hire a brewery. Yeah, they did, they did work at a brewery but they... Was it? Or it was like a kitchen? It looks like they hired a kitchen.
There was a brewery, I forget, I read somewhere that they did work at a brewery on it but...
You know, they made a $10 at best beer, like, you know, a six pack for 10 bucks.
And they sold it for 150 bucks.
And then the what the Falcon Heavy flew up. Oh, it did. I didn't see that.
So I wasn't something happened.
They were doing a launch. They called it a successful mission.
But after separation, so the vehicle wasn't damaged, but the booster blew up okay but this what about the Starship are the heavy booster mm-hmm the launch vehicle I guess it was Starship that one made it on top of the heavy yeah I think it made it to orbit oh it did they said well okay maybe today it might have been suborbital what happened yeah they said the space so maybe I don't know if the space means orbital or suborbital probably some world probably yeah they would have mentioned because I don't think was ever meant to be.
But you know, SpaceX is doing the whole spin. Successful mission, you know, unexpected abrupt disassembly or whatever they call an explosion.
Rapid unplanned disassembly.

[24:24] But was every mission parameter met? I think the booster was supposed to land and it blew up.
Well the booster was supposed to land softly in the ocean.
Actually I think this I'm supposed to splash down. Yeah, the Pacific but yeah But it exploded.
Yeah, it went boom Not surprising Everybody's alive. Did did it make it huge?
Oh, it's unmanned. Yeah. See I wasn't paying any attention to it Well, and it was on land that it no. No, it was unmanned.
Oh, yeah Did it make a huge big because the big problem with the last one was it made this huge cloud of dirt that Was like on the launch pad.
Yeah, they had some exhaust deflectors that were water-cooled.
I know very little But the little I do know is they outfitted the launch pad with some exhaust deflectors that were water-cooled steel So and that worked it sounded I know almost nothing about it, but it sounded like it was a good, addition to that Because they didn't want to build a flame trench.
Well, they kind of couldn't they're doing it in a wetland.

[25:35] So, when they did it the first time and there was no flame printer, they have 36 engines on this thing. It's a lot of force.
And it just blew up the stand it was on, because you need to deflect that energy somehow.
So okay, they're doing it with this reverse shower head, basically.
It's a shower head that points up.
And I was curious to see if that worked, but I guess the math behind the sound...
Oh, so just helping the flowing water absorb the energy? Like the Space Shuttle did?
Yep. Well, that was more about acoustic energy, but this is actually like literally the water is absorbing all that energy.

[26:16] Which I guess worked. I mean, I haven't seen it, but I think the math is decently sound.
But a flame trench is probably still better.
I used to hold SpaceX in such high respect and maybe I still should but just because of Elon Musk's Twitter bullshit I almost like find SpaceX like it's lost like yeah so much stock for me and it because I, Have no respect for no, I mean like like SpaceX is Is the one thing that he seemed to have done that that legit?
Has kept up. Like the Falcon 9 is a very mature vehicle.
And they were not the first to come up with the idea of, you know, landing rockets like that, but they were the first to do it and make it routine.
Yeah, like Blue Origin still had work on orbital right? Yeah, and that deserves a lot of props. It really does.

[27:20] It's not like it was impossible, clearly, but it was people weren't willing to go through and do the engineering necessary to get that to work right, and they decided to do it.
At a certain point it was impossible, because no one had the engineering to do it.
It's impossible at that point. I mean, remember, these rockets, right, they're intentionally.

[27:49] Especially the Falcon 9, it's essentially a scaffold. It's made of aluminum. It's really light.
They fill it up with a bunch of fuel, so it's heavy.
But by the time it's, you know, it's got all that fuel down, it's a very, very light thing.
I mean, compared to what you would think of for something that tall, made of metal, it's hollow.

Landing Boosters and the Physics Behind It

[28:12] It's empty and it's thin.
So that thing is really light. And you've got a little fuel in there.
So just the nature of it, it's going to slosh down in gravity and it's going to be pointing downward.
So you have physics helping you to get that.
So all you have to do is just add a little bit more to give you some direction.
One of the points you made between Blue Origin and SpaceX a long time ago is, they're not just landing the booster, they're landing a booster that boosted the payload to orbital velocities.

[28:53] No, it didn't. Oh the second. No, you second. This is the second stage gets it to orbital velocity, right?
The booster just gets it It just gets it that It does the hard part which is getting you.
All right Getting you off and and getting you aloft Most of the energy you want to put into yourself is not up.
It's It's to the side. You want to get yourself a lot of energy going in the direction.
So you're so Going in or down right down range. You're good.
You want to get yourself in the direction of the rotation here, right?
Because I thought you told me once like landing a SpaceX booster is substantially more, Difficult because of the velocities it reaches versus like a blue origin, which is just doing a parabolic flight or something Um, I do think that there is more it's more complicated.

[29:51] But I do know that physics is helping you a bit because of just the nature of the way things are working, It's still a problem but it's a problem that was solvable and it's a problem that they solved and it's telling that a lot of the like China and a couple other places are going for a very similar design to the Falcon 9 and, And then remember the SpaceX was designed to be able to put this satellite constellation in orbit and the problem is that the Falcon 9 is a pretty, I mean not just pretty, it is a solid, just plain solid platform that is well understood but it doesn't have the payload capacity to do what they need for Starlink mm-hmm so they had to make up the Starship thing and it's kind of crazy and maybe they'll get there maybe they won't with Elon Musk in charge especially the way that Twitter broke him apparently like I don't know that he was necessarily great beforehand, but Twitter clearly destroyed whatever bit of sanity was left there.

Elon Musk's Twitter Controversies and Impact on SpaceX

[31:13] He did that. Or could have been.

[31:18] I mean, I wanna blame Twitter just because I think that Twitter. He did it.
Twitter allows you to be. It was the Twitter platform before he owned it drove him crazy, I mean.
It allows you to be evil to people without having any other way to contact them.
And it makes it so simple to be evil to people.
And that's awful.

[31:51] That wasn't why I rejected Twitter at first. Remember because I rejected Twitter then I kind of really enjoyed it and then that's calm then I stopped I, Just jumped off Twitter While the show was still, you know, what the first iteration of the show is still going and I was like no I'm off Twitter Because it just became a cesspool that I wasn't I did not want to be a part of yeah and, Now it's even worse, Oh Um About two weeks ago or so Gary Frank messaged me.
Oh, really? He's so happy that we're back Oh cool, and I'm like happy until you're the episode where we talked Hi Gary No, seriously, Gary, Yeah, it seems to that's right on the whole the water under the bridge kind of thing But he was psyched we were just because we disagree with him politically does not mean that that we disagree with him in any other way mm-hmm, so, That's the thing is we've made- Everybody has different views.
We've made politics into such an important part of life when it shouldn't be.

[32:57] We should understand that people can have different politics and still want the same thing overall, which is want the best for everybody.
They just have different ways of thinking that they can achieve it.
It's not, people with different politics are not evil.
There are different people with different politics New that are evil, but that doesn't mean deep to all people different politics are evil.
I Think I want you, Once you you know absorb that then All of these social media things get harder to deal with because Everyone leads with their politics these days and it sucks, Because, in some sense, you feel like you have to, because communities gatekeep by what, your policies are, by what your politics are.
And they shouldn't, but they do.

[33:57] All of them. Us included. We shouldn't, but we do. It's part of the culture now and it sucks.
I think that it's a part of culture that I can legitimately say sucks as opposed to me being somebody who's like, oh, I'm, you know, nearing 50 and I don't like the music the kids are doing.
That I recognize as me just being an old fucking- You are known as the curmudgeonly blowhard.

Appreciating the Big Bang Theory

[34:24] I Like to think I don't fit into that anymore because That's not me anymore.
Like that is me when it comes to dramatic presentation of things on, Like I'm very particular about that, but I also am not going to We I'm not gonna shit on the Big Bang Theory anymore.
People love it for a good reason So tonight you had a very cool experience We're at the the blacksmithing thing. Greg is like a bottle opener.
He's a little bit out of his element. He's not Making things with his hands very often And then one of the guys in the class asks Craig the host like what is metal glow?
Like what makes it glow red and Craig wasn't totally sure It's like hold my beer I got that, this is my wheelhouse.
And yeah, so I explained to them black body radiation and I don't know if I did a great job of it, but I was really excited. People were into it.
People were gathering around you. You missed like the last step of your bottle openers because you were busy going on. I was talking to Julie about different stuff. We were talking to. Oh, that's totally cool.
I'm glad you had made a connection, you know, and you know.

[35:43] I'm, sure it felt good to be like valued in this like Oh, somebody else cares about this shit. Like I do you're in a workshop You weren't expecting to talk about quantum physics Guess what?
But yeah, no, like if you want to know why it lights up. I know exactly what it does Give our listeners a quick reason.
So you put metal in a furnace and when it hits like 1700 degrees it glows red Yeah, well, so the thing is thing the first thing to recognize that everything glows That's that's the first thing that you need to understand.
Everything glows. Everything glows.
Am I glowing? You are glowing. You just can't see it. I can go get my camera from downstairs if you want to see it.
Yeah, if you have an infrared camera you can definitely see it.
I'm sure you've seen the pictures that just show up.
Because yeah, relative to your surroundings you're pretty hot. You're glowing.
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to take that as a compliment. We all are.
Relative to your surroundings, like Yumi and Shana, she's relatively hot.
You're pretty hot, thanks.
It is true in many ways. I need another drink.

[36:53] I need an improved whiskey cocktail, please. You're drinking the magnanimous, you'll be better. But, you know, on the same level, so is this computer.
Oh, that makes me feel so much better. You just need to stop talking.
Anyway, so you're giving off light your eyes can't see.

[37:13] You're giving off light that is visible in other wavelengths that your eyes aren't adapted to see.
And the thing about temperature that's really interesting is as things get hotter, they start to give out more of this because they're trying to get rid of this energy.

[37:33] So I'm so hot and I'm trying to get rid of... You are constantly trying to become in equilibrium with your surroundings, but you're too hot.
I see. You're too hot to be in equilibrium with your surroundings.
But you also have to stay warm to stay alive. So it's a battle of nature.
So energy is flowing out of you and you need to eat and consume in order to keep that energy going on in you.
Mm-hmm, but we can do this artificially by heating things up, indirectly or directly and They will start to emit higher and higher wavelengths of energy, There's a quantum mechanical reason for this This is Planck's law, but basically the idea is that, We have something called black-body radiation so everything Everything is a radiator in some sense, it radiates.
But a perfect black body in physics is something that does not reflect any light, it only radiates.
So the most perfect black body, do you know what the most perfect black body in the solar system is?
No. Beyonce. Nope.

[38:52] No, it's not. Beyonce reflects light, that's why.
That's why you can see her. But there are things that don't reflect light, they emit light.
And the biggest black body in the solar system is also the biggest object in the solar system is the sun. Put it back out.
The sun basically doesn't reflect light, it only radiates light.

[39:24] In radius light at a particular temperature, it gets really, really hot. 6,000 Kelvin, something like that.
So, before we get too far, I want to ask this question and I don't want to lose it.
The sun doesn't reflect light because of its structure?
It does reflect a tiny bit of light, but most of the light that hits it is absorbed because of its material, its structure.
It's not a good reflector. It just isn't it doesn't have the properties that a good reflector would have.
It's mostly an emitter a Good reflector is in many cases a decent conductor, Silver is a very good reflector.
For example copper is a decent reflector, But that gets into more Physics II and electron stuff that you need to really consider, but essentially just think that the sun emits way more light than it reflects.
Of course, I mean, that's clear. I'm just kind of surprised that it doesn't reflect light. It does a little bit, it's not a perfect black body.
A perfect black body would not reflect any light, but the closest thing to a perfect black body in the solar system is the sun.

Heat and Radiation: Equilibrium and Energy Release

[40:47] So, as things start to get hotter, they start to send off more radiation.
They start to try to get in equilibrium with their surroundings.
But as they're hotter, they gotta release more energy.
Because that's what heat is. It's energy. It's things moving around.

[41:11] So the things that are moving around are kind of stuck in the structure of this big piece of iron here.
So they don't have enough energy to get boiled off, but they have enough energy to move around enough to wiggle in the right way, they're gonna create electromagnetic energy.
And that is going to be flowing off of this.
First in invisible rays, but as you get more and more hot, in things that are visible by our eyes.
In general.

[41:53] Our eyes are sort of fixed to seeing things that are about the right temperature as the Sun.
I wonder why that is. We tend to be able to see things that are very, very close to the right wavelength of things that are reflected on Earth. Right.
Not the temperature of the sun, but things that reflect the wavelengths of light that come off the sun. Yeah.
Fascinating. And infrared doesn't really get to us from the sun.
Like, I mean, things heat up. The sun absolutely heats things up, but not to the point where our eyes are more tuned to things that are, yeah, like reflecting stuff in daylight.

[42:50] Whereas there are some animals who have come up with ways to, it's like, let's, let's, Let's be clear, you have ways to feel things that are hot even though they are not glowing hot. Right.
You put your hand near something that is really hot but not glowing, you can definitely feel it.
Right. You don't see it visually, you feel it.
There are creatures that have developed things to augment, as we understand it, their visual perception with this heat sensitivity in crazy ways.
Biology has done really cool things. I mean, reptiles have a different organ that do it, they don't do it with their eyes.
Did you see the recent Veritasium where they did the night vision goggles stuff? Yes I did.
That was really wild. I didn't know enough about military night vision to know how that worked, that was really cool.
I mean, I do know that I have like the cameras I have I are lights on them and they're sent And so they see the IR that's reflected, Relatively high energy IR But yeah, those the military ones are the passive analog.
Yeah passive They do this crazy thing where they start electron cascades.
I mean, that's just that's just That was something that That's a photo multiplier.
That's the thing that's been used in physics for a long time.
They just be able to get them really tiny and into really, you know.

[44:18] Into efficient methods. It runs on 1.5 volts on AAA battery.
I was shocked that like the best night vision out there runs on like one battery.
I mean, you understand when you hear that, oh, that's why it cost $4,000 to get real night vision goggles and then the cheap ones are like 200 bucks, but they're just an IR camera Yeah, and you get a delay Because together processing.

[44:47] So, if you wanted to get really cool IR vision, like the military, you best join the military.
Or... Well, even on the military stuff, the infrared stuff wasn't as good as the light amplification stuff. Yeah.
Their really good light amplification stuff was crazy.
And that was just stuff they were showing Veritasium, which means they have at least a generation, if not two, better.
That's how, like, particle accelerators, you know, the first ones, and I'm sure the most recent ones are much better technology, but the idea is you would receive a little bit of energy and then you get a photomultiplier that would then multiply that energy enough for you to be able to actually then sense it on your equipment.
So the idea is the same, it's a multiplier of photons, but it's just done in a more compressed way than a particle accelerator which requires a lot of energy and a lot of, it's just a lot just a lot of a lot yeah.

Personal Perspective on Middle East Conflict and Anti-Semitism

[46:03] Um I don't there's lots I could talk about like there's a whole thing happening on the other side of the world that is very, um, it's very hard for me to talk about for lots of reasons.
Oh, you mean in the Middle East? Yes.
I bet. Because there are dimensions that I feel that most people don't.
As someone who grew up in a Jewish family, like I Mentioned before I don't consider myself Jewish.
I don't Believe in that I don't even culturally consider myself Jewish, but as my parents have made myself they made me Very well aware of that doesn't matter to the people who hate Jews Mm-hmm.
They don't give a shit that I don't consider myself Jewish I'm Jewish to them, right?
So when there's a lot of very obvious anti-semitism, it affects me in a way that it probably doesn't affect most other people.

[47:19] When there is a lot of Jewish people supporting a country that is doing things that are pretty bad, You feel that more, especially when it's something that you don't support, but you feel like it's just drawing attention to certain things.
What's the thing I read that like, there's a...
The arc of conspiracy is short and it leans towards Jews.
Whenever somebody comes up with conspiracy theory the first people first thing that the people think is Jews are doing it and it's it gets a lot easier do that when there's a Jewish country, doing some horrible shit it's not to say that these people weren't provoked they were.
There was a provocation that happened.

[48:33] And there's also an understanding that is part of the culture, which is the world tried to destroy you before.
And if somebody is going to do that again, fight. Fight. Fight.
It's hard to explain that to some culture that hasn't gone through that.

Questioning Israeli settlements in Palestine

[49:07] I remember at my last, uh, can I ask a question? Please. Settlements.
They seem wrong. I agree. What's the, in settlements, for people who might not be paying attention, Israel seems to have a habit of encroaching on Palestine's space and displacing the Muslims and building neighborhoods and moving Jews into there, Israelis into there.
And it seems like they're just being bullies and taking more space.

[49:46] What's Do you can you come up with what it or explain to me the why that's okay no argument, Do you know is there one like if you had the parrot when you don't believe it is there a justification I, Don't know I'm just asking cuz you know, I mean the only How did we get in?
So I walked away and yeah, you're going munchies and I was we're talking about how did we get out into the sun?
I brought it up. Okay. I brought it up because there's a thing going on in the world. Yeah.
That is hard to not pay attention to. Absolutely.
And it is affecting my state of mind. Absolutely.
I have no doubt. Yeah, I mean, he made a really good point.
I mean, I my very close family is being affected by this too.
I mean, Gregory at the point. I'm gonna make sure you hear it. He might have heard it.
It's like he doesn't consider himself Jewish, but by blood by heritage People who don't like Jews sees a Jew right there, you know that kind of thing. So it does affect him.
Yeah So.

[51:01] What I believe I'm trying to steel man the position as best I can Is something I don't believe in I don't agree with, I think the position that the Israeli government has is...

[51:22] Trying to figure out some way of putting this thing. I'm glad you're having a hard time with it because to me and it's it's a Small view, but it's like that's a huge part of the problem right now is like stop settlements.
Yeah, I Think that part of so, Israelis, Really think we tried peace and didn't work, They came close to an agreement in the Oslo Accords, and then it was rejected.
And so there's a feeling that they just don't want peace.
So we want to expand.
This is land that isn't being used, or maybe this is land that is being used, but it's valuable land.
It's land that we technically control, because they won it in a war that was fought, that was not originally Israeli land, but then there was a war that was fought as soon as Israel was founded, and this land was won in that war.
Six countries attacked, and Israel pushed back and won this land.
So there's a feeling that this land is theirs now.

[52:43] And the claims that are there from other people are just.

[52:54] Attempts to get the Jews out. And that's all it's about.
That's the best way I can see a man in that position. It's not one I agree with, but it is I think what the feeling is behind it.
Do you ever think there's gonna be peace? Not now.

Lack of trust and the unlikelihood of peace

[53:11] There? I mean, not, I mean. Not, I mean, ever. When everyone's dead?
Because there's, for as long as I can remember, there's never really been peace there. There's too little trust.
Oh yeah. For anything right now.
Um, what I've like this whole thing with where Israel invaded a hospital, this is the most recent thing. Mm hmm.
And my feeling was there better be tons of evidence of Hamas shit going down there.
And so far, nothing is not now. And so this is a big setback for Israel.

[54:05] And big setback for this whole operation.
Yeah, because babies, you have. Yes, you have to justify that shit you're doing by saying that you're in greater danger.

[54:21] Meanwhile, these are. People, me, babies and NICUs that are dying.
And you are killing a lot more people than like, again, and you were just, you were attacked, and it's scary, in a way that is hard to imagine, although as Americans, we have some sort of, some sort of shared imagination because of 9-11, has the same sort of similar cultural scar.
I don't have an imagination of a rocket landing in my backyard.
You know, like, to me, I can't comprehend living in a place where- No, no, the imagination It's not that these specifics it's about your illusion of safety being punctured It's I don't think we have, Any comprehension of what they're going through?
No, but I'm just trying to give it the closest thing I can come to Which I think is a really mild I mean, no, it's scarred America.
It's It didn't land in our backyard.
I'd like literally your backyard, it landed in New York City, you know?
Yes, but I was fearful of shit for over a year. Yeah, for sure.
That something like this would happen to me. This was...

[55:50] You know, the idea that this even could happen was so preposterous that when it did happen, it shocked the system.
And it's still a scar that remains on the American psyche today.
And I think that's the closest I can come to the kind of shock that this Hamas raid did on Israel.
Because there were people that were just killed in very barbaric ways.

[56:22] And the people of Israel were basically given a guarantee that this would not be able to happen.
And all of that was shown to be an illusion, and now Israelis are extremely scared.
And I remember that there was a quote that Biden quoted from Golda Meir, who used to be the It was one time the premier of Israel.
She said that the reason why we fight so hard is because we have no place else to go.

[56:54] There's a real cultural belief in that. That there's nowhere else.
This is it. This is the final one. If...
You know, and Hamas, their philosophy that they pronounce to the world, and they've lightened it a bit, but their philosophy that Israel understands is kill all the Jews.

[57:24] So, when they were attacked like this by what they believe is a people that just want to kill them all, They Come back with all right. Well, then we're just going to kill all of you.
Mm-hmm I don't think that's a good way to approach the problem So but I can't speak for the people who are there who are living, Pretty ignorant question When Israel was founded Where did the immigrants come from a lot probably came from Europe?
Mm-hmm. Was there a lot from the United States to no, no, no the vast majority were from Europe.
Okay But there were there were Jews who lived there, but you know, there were Jews.
There's a Diaspora of choosing around the world, But I think the vast majority were in a SCSI Jews who were Jews in Europe.

[58:25] And There were people who who were pushed out of their homes, who had lived in these homes.
Yeah, this was British territory, it was hilarious.
And the British said, okay, we're making a new state and we're pushing people out of their homes and giving this.
And so people legitimately, you know, they had homes that they'd lived there for a long time and they wanna go back.

The Issue of Land and Reservations

[58:55] And like we recognize in the United States, We did that to a lot of people.
And we're not giving them land back. We just give them reservations. Right.
And land acknowledgments. Sure. But we're not like saying, oh, you get the you get Manhattan back.
That's way too valuable for us. No, no, you get this land that no one's using that is just empty.
And there's no important rivers there. You know, there's no value there.

[59:37] Go figure it out here. I've been listening to a podcast that's really good, Stuff the Bridge Stole.

[59:46] They're in the third season. It was another podcast that I've been listening to. 99% invisible, they featured him in one.
And it's a really good podcast because it's not just like straight up like first level this, right?
It gets into like the deeper meaning of things and stuff like that.
Really good. I've just finished up all three seasons of Stuff the British Stole and haven't got into the Israeli state or anything like that.
But lots of other things like the Maori people in New Zealand.
I was thinking about the partitioning that happened with India and Pakistan.
There was some Indian stuff, yeah.
There was some, like the use of zero as a decimal separate, like a decimal point place type thing, like it was established, in these documents in India, which, Yeah, and like but India once it wanted it back, but actually the place where the documents were we're now Pakistan's or does India really get it, you know, like it gets in a whole whole thing there, but, It's really good. I would recommend check out.
It's it's from the Australian broadcasting compass II company is who puts it off.

[1:01:10] But so, you know, I have my parents are huge Israel supporters.
They were just recently in Israel.
They are very strongly pro-Israel. My sister is very much, on the other side, like me. Um.
But understanding of the we got pushed into our heads enough.

[1:01:47] However, one thing that I've tried to express to my parents that never really got through for some reason.
My parents were very, very adamant when we were young about, I mean, they, they experienced, they're boomers, they experienced the Holocaust secondhand. They weren't alive during it, but they were alive in very much the aftermath.
And, you know, when a lot of it came out, and it's very powerful.
One of the things that was very important, they nailed it to us in Hebrew school was, never again. The phrase never again.

[1:02:25] I took that to mean, and I was taught by the teachers in the Hebrew school that I went to, that that doesn't mean never again for Jews that means never again for anybody, my parents very much think of it as never again for Jews so when I have come back to them with the never again that doesn't work on them so it's a a weird disconnect.
Because to me, never again legit means... Never. Never. Never again.
So, I have this thing where it's like, I just don't, I try not to talk to my parents about that and if it comes up, I try to give them a lot of latitude.
Because otherwise I'm just going to get angry and upset. and that doesn't help anything.
I'm not gonna convince them of anything. They've come to their mind a while ago and they aren't going to listen to somebody who has compassion because they don't have it anymore.
It's sad.

Finding Joy in the Chaos of Life

[1:03:46] But, that's life. World's a fucked up place.
You you get joy when you can, Savor it Say we did these beers when you when you can drink a beer that's as awesome as some of the beers we had tonight like the oxbow when you can create a, Blacksmithing abomination like this, That I'm holding in my hand because what the hell why not.

[1:04:27] If life is pain, then there's some pain that's good. There's some pain that's worth living.
And we get the chance to experience. Go for it.
Take your opportunities. When Jeff offered it, I was like, yeah, I'll do that.
I didn't think you'd be interested. I was surprised when you said yes.
So I'm really happy that you came.
It's something new to learn, something new to try, something that, if I mess up, ain't gonna hurt anybody.

[1:05:05] If I pay attention, I'm not gonna hurt myself. Mm-hmm.
Yeah, sure. I get a free lesson in something that's cool that I would never do.
Now you know you'll never do it. I mean I was pretty convinced before, but now I have real empirical confirmation.
This is not for me.
I'm happy to let somebody else go scrounging for anvils and perhaps make a lot of money doing it, but also be really into collecting a lot of vans and fixing them up.
And it's like, okay, I mean you you're trying to convince us to like, Become peddlers of anvils for some reason Whereas like I'm just happy to let you do it and let you enjoy them the proceeds.
It's the cult leader You didn't know that It's very obvious after being with him for a little bit of time that yeah, that's that's the energy he gives off for sure.

[1:06:16] I like a fine likeable guy. Probably not a guy that I'm gonna have a lot in common with, but decent fun to be around in the right occasion, yeah.

[1:06:37] I'm probably not going to agree to be driving his van down somewhere. That's just not in me.
But you know, I'm glad that you were able to do it. I had so much fun driving that van.
Yeah, I don't driving is tedious to me. So it's the same tedium. Well, that sanding is, that whole saying of stopping and smelling the roses.

Embracing the Beauty of the Moment

[1:07:01] So I mean, it was a perfect everything about that day was perfect.
Because it was a beautiful, perfect day.
The temperature, I don't know, 65, 70 degrees.
I don't even remember, but I know the sun was shining and the leaves were peaking.
So, and we couldn't take highways. We had to take back roads all the way.
So you're driving through this farm country, you know, up and down all these hills, around these curves, through these tunnels, over these bridges, under these bridges and everything else and through farmland and Amish country and all of this.

[1:07:51] And you're not driving, you're not going 100 miles an hour.
You can't. You can't. Couldn't even want to do it.
And you're just enjoying the moment, you know? And that's what I got out of that day.
Like, I mean, it was fun driving because I started driving, when I was 13, I was driving a VW Bug, which was ultimately, it was my first vehicle, it was a VW Bug, but I learned how to drive on a VW Bug when I was 13 years old.
And to drive a VW van again at my age now, all these years later, and I'm not going to tell you how many years, but I mean, it was just really nostalgic.
And then to add the view, the beauty of it all, you know, it was just, it was a really nice day and we weren't rushed to get anywhere at any certain time, although we wanted to try to get back to Pittsburgh before dark.

[1:09:11] That was the only thing that was our goal.
Other than that, it was just driving and just getting to where we needed to go and taking in everything as we were going.
So yeah, it was beautiful, it was fun. So I hate driving.
I like that you can get to places by driving And that's awesome.
I find driving tedious and very, very, I as as someone with, you know, pretty severe ADD, it's very, it occupies my mind when it's happening and when I'd rather be doing other things.

[1:10:01] And so that's why I really like my car right now, because if I get onto a highway, It'll basically drive itself. That's really nice. That's great.
I still am a person who I don't like to drive any. If I like, I don't like to drive more than an hour.
Definitely don't like to drive any more than four hours. That's kind of like my limit, maybe five.
It just is. It hurts my brain somehow to do it a lot.
And I don't really have a good explanation for why.
I've never been into cars. I have friends who are car people who are super into like watching car shows and how great their cars are and their engines are.
And I don't give two shits.
I just want a car that will get me from one place to another in the most comfortable way that I can be.

Nostalgic love for old game systems

[1:11:00] So to me it sounds like when you say that I'm like okay what's my equivalent of that and that would be somebody who's like I have all these really old game systems let's say I'm a ColecoVision and television like you want to check all out.
I'm like, hell yes.
I want to see what all these do. I want to see what the ZX-80 will do.
I want to see what you have for the Amiga.
Like I want to see all that shit. That's like, yes.
That to me is, I want to see like where games were and how far games have come.
How... I don't know if I necessarily want to get into the technical details of all the consoles, but I do want to like check come all out and see what they did. See how they did certain things.
That is like, that's the nostalgia that hits me on that level.
So, I get it. I totally get it. But last year when I offered, like we should go down to PA Pinball and play these retro video games.
I know what to do for a long time.
You're like. Okay.
I'll get bored of that pretty quickly unless you have like a lot of different things.

[1:12:27] I still think we should take her to PA Timbaland. Just see if he likes it.
I think such a but You know, I did mention to you the thing that would be more fun to me in my mind would be either if we go Into the you know, it is does golfing, you know, like the the indoor putt-putt things.
Okay, or I love escape rooms You introduce me to them.
I can't do escape rooms. They're so much fun. You don't think you can do escape No, I know I can't. How do you know?
Because I'm way too claustrophobic. I'm not claustrophobic. You're not.
You don't see you. You're not going to be able to convince me of that.
You're this is the size of an escape room. Are you claustrophobic right now?
I can get out. I know. There's two exits, Adam. Sweet, actually.
I'm freaking out. I'm walking out that door.
But if you go out that door and you're trying to win the game, you don't win the game. You're not going to be able to convince me.
It's not going to happen. Well, anyway, I love escape rooms because I love working with other people to solve problems.
I love that. That's so much fun for me. And that's why I loved the game Pandemic until it became kind of gauche.

[1:13:40] Because you're working with other people to solve the problem. I still like that game.
It's been really hard to play it after the pandemic. Yeah. No, we just kind of changed terminology.
Like, you know, we're always like, oh, that's norovirus.
That's COVID now.
I mean, the simple game mechanics of pandemic didn't really, didn't, didn't really come true.
It runs away from you fast. Like, yeah, that's true.
But I I love the, I love working with other people to do something.
I loved being in that, I would volunteer for that reptile sanctuary if that was close.
That'd be cool to be just, you know, feeding these turtles and.
Tori knows a guy, Nate, who runs Nate's Reptile.
I don't know if it's a good place or if it's like some slime ball who just can't get enough reptiles using it as a cover to get more reptiles. I don't know.
You could talk to Tori, but if you wanted to volunteer, she probably could point you to it.
If any place in town is worth volunteering at, she would know.

[1:15:00] Right? I mean, you're totally. Yeah. Yeah. I have Had a lot of good experiences with a few reptiles that I've been in contact with, and I've actually so it's funny cuz I got home and from from Arizona I was like I'm gonna play a little bit with But for me and for me got real mad at me and bite and bit me a couple times Was not into it.
So I have embarked on And the next step of his re-education, which is, okay, I'm going to hold you every day for 15 minutes.
And we're going to go through this and you're going to get desensitized to this.
So far it's going very well.
He's an explorer and I got to appreciate that.
Because he's not one to sit around and just sit on me and just hang out.
No, he wants to explore everywhere. And so he's gonna get in tangles of stuff.
I I Made the mistake of having a fan out.
It was not a running fan It was not even plugged in but he went inside.

[1:16:09] Okay, so I just put it in his enclosure closed it waited till he came out completely and just took it out, If he squeezed himself in there, it was real happy to just sort of sit in there It's like, fuck you, Greg. All right.
Noted.

Understanding the snake's behavior and overcoming fear

[1:16:33] But he has been very when I do this.
He's gotten, I think, used to it in the sense that, OK, this is happening.
I'm not scared. It was very clear when I picked him up the first that first time when he got really bitey, he was really hanging on real tightly. He was scared.
That's why he bit me.
And so I try to grab him before he really has a chance to get scared and sort of then be very not grabbing in any way and just be open and just treadmill him and be like, okay, just explore.
Keep that, Keep him in the sense of all right. I'm not in danger, So let's see what's out here as opposed to the sense of Holy fuck what's happening?
I'm I'm treadmill. This is a gigantic It's gotta be frustrating to the snake you'd think so, but this is not a very I mean, isn't it?
It's more intelligent than Penrose is more intelligent my leopard gecko, but he's not like they're not thinking, they're not frustrated by this, this is...

[1:17:50] This doesn't, it doesn't seem that this frustrates them. At least with the few snakes I've encountered.
It does not seem the treadmill actually frustrates them. They just feel like they're... They're progressing. They're progressing.
They don't seem to care that, wait a minute, this isn't working right.
They feel like they're progressing. They're not being restricted.
So they're not feeling that they're in danger. Makes sense. Makes sense.

[1:18:21] Yeah, the same way. They don't have the emotional connection level and they also don't seem to have that.
This is getting tedious Well, why isn't this working?
No, they They put in emotion they get the right feedback.
Mm-hmm. All's good. Yeah I've been watching this guy from New England reptiles who's you're talking about how you have to sort of watch them and understand that they they go through these sort of phases and And you want them to.

[1:18:54] They're observing, and they're going to download it into their brain, and they're going to look at that information. They don't do it at the same time.
And so you sort of wait for them to get this. It really seems to be very much tied to their tongue motion.

[1:19:12] When they do a large tongue motion, or if it's a lizard, they sort of lick around the side.
And that's when you can tell, okay, they're downloading it into their brain what just happened, and they're gonna now have a different understanding of the situation than it was before, if you've presented them with a different understanding of the situation.
So, like, they are in, like, React mode, and then observe, download, and then they can be in a different sort of React mode.
They don't do it at the same time like we do. At least that's the way that he interprets his interactions.
And once I sort of got into that frame of mind, I understood more about what it felt like.
At least I understood more about how Fermi was acting.
And even how Panamoros was acting in certain cases. They get into modes and then they aren't thinking about what they're doing.
They'll think about what they're doing when they have a chance to analyze, but in the moment they're not thinking about it.

Post Show Wrap-Up and Thanks

[1:20:27] Gotcha, We good I think so think good All right. Thanks everyone for the post show.
We enjoyed it What you got something to say? No say yes, I'm the same.
No, yeah, I got something No, say it you got a new time. Let's go. Nothing.
Let's go Yeah, talk about I'm gonna make something but we'll have a oh Yeah, we'll do the giveaway on the next show.
All right. Well teaser any any Progress with regards to the oh, I just thought about like literally yesterday Yeah, no, so I'll get the parts.
I'll get you the prices and stuff.
Yep Cool. See you on the elevator and you wanted something else.
Oh, you only put together the oscilloscope. No, no No, that's fine.
I don't care about that Um, just I wasn't limited here.
The other thing we talked about was the PZ Electric, uh... Oh, Cloud Chamber.
Cloud Chamber. But that, yeah, that's probably not... And you want me to put together the oscilloscope.
I don't know. I gave you the stuff for the oscilloscope. I don't really want one. I don't know what I'd do with one. Okay.
Gotcha. Yeah, no, I was working on a project.

[1:21:44] So Shannon and I are getting like, trying like, probably gonna like start an LLC for like tax purposes, but like a maker, woodworking company.
And- We're pretty darn good, actually. You are, you guys are.
The stuff you make is awesome.
Yeah, we'll see. Thank you. I mean, I like to think we're pretty darn good, but I'm saying we're pretty darn good because we've gotten a lot of people who have said we're pretty darn good. So on Instagram is kind of the place where makers like network and stuff.
So if you want to see it Gnarly burl. Yeah, that's our Instagram.
They burl gnarly burl is better PDG is better PDG pretty darn good But yeah, no actually wasn't taken so.

[1:22:34] They had this thing where there's this group on Instagram, they did this like logo swap thing.
So I entered, because I thought it would just be another fun make thing posted on Instagram type stuff.
And got, made the guy's logo, did something really cool with it.
Got some pretty cool feedback, so. Some?
Yeah, some. Have you read today? No, I haven't looked at it today.
You've gotten a lot. What?
Yeah. I'm blown up, I'm going viral.
He's going to be an influencer. PDG, baby. Gnarly Burl's going viral.
Gnarly Burl's going to be an influencer. Gnarly Burl's going viral.
Send us shit. I did notice that in his...
Area there was an Instagram thing that was counting his subscribers.
It went up by one when we were there.
It actually went down by a bunch since yet like oh really since last time I was there.
It was like an 18 191. It was definitely 18 twos like last time I was there so.
That's interesting I didn't know it counted. And you know bat bots.
But anyway gnarly burl follow us on Instagram. That's not what we're doing. Yes.
Check out what we're doing man. We're making shit and It's pretty freaking awesome.
There's like it's fun. There's like a half a person listening.
So so probably.

Enter the Gnarly Burl Giveaway on Instagram

[1:24:04] If you heard this, oh here comes the giveaway, here we go gnarly burl Send us a message on discord, private message. No, no, no, on Instagram.
On Instagram? Yeah, we gotta grow a person. Okay, yes, go to Instagram, find Gnarly Burl. You're getting maybe two people.
And then you can reference Craft Beer Radio in the comments.
Make sure it's Craft Beer Radio. Craft Beer Radio in the comments of Gnarly Burl, I don't care which video you comment on, it doesn't matter.
Just reference Craft Beer Radio.
First. Hashtag give me a pen.
You will get one of my pens. Hashtag give me a pen. And I'm telling you, it's gonna be a freaking awesome pen. You'll like the pen.
It's a really cool pen. So hashtag give me a pen. Yeah. Give me a pen.
I already got a bowl from them, so. Hashtag give me a pen. I'm set.
Narly Burl, G-N-A-R-L-Y, space, B-U-R-L.
No space. Narly Burl. Or not space. On Instagram. Narly, we're gonna get something way different.
Hashtag, give me a pen. Give me a pen.

[1:25:29] I feel like what you have to ship it like 40 pens. I like like well, just like.

Greg McGill: The First in the Future

[1:25:44] You know Greg McGill's gonna be the first person to do that, But he's in the future he lives in the future that's how he does it, If you, respond, and you happen to live in the United States and you might be able to get to Pittsburgh sometime, just like Greg McGill, you may be able to get on the show yourself.
Or we might take you to Barefoot Forge and you can make your own You get to meet Craig. Bottle opener.
You get to meet Craig. And meet Craig. Think about how amazing that will be for you.
All right. I think that's our show. I think we can put the end on.
Good night everybody. Craig. Craig. Craig. Hey, I lasted.